An Electric Motor That Works in Any Classic Car
A plug-and-play electric motor for cars makes it easier than ever to upgrade your vintage ride
spectrum.ieee.org
Electric Crate Motor For classic cars.
- Thread starter nyccsi
- Start date
spectrum.ieee.org
Modified your title to reflect the nature of the link.
Belgiumbarry
Well-Known Member
a bit overkill "fake" making it look like a V8.....
Mike Goble
Well-Known Member
“A lot of guys go out for a weekend in a classic car that’s 40 or 50 years old, but they get a ride home with AAA; it ends up being a one-way trip,”
The secret to a successful weekend is to drive it during the week as well and sort out the problems. My E3 has never left me stranded in 14 years and hundreds of thousands of miles. Once this electric motor is installed you are limited to less than 150 miles?
The secret to a successful weekend is to drive it during the week as well and sort out the problems. My E3 has never left me stranded in 14 years and hundreds of thousands of miles. Once this electric motor is installed you are limited to less than 150 miles?
I preach this all the time!! The more you drive it, the quicker you will sort out any issues, before they leave you stranded.
Back to topic... there are two shops in Austin that specialize in electric conversions. Moment Motors is working on an e9 right now. https://www.momentmotors.com/
I've ridden in their red 2002... it is very nice and well suited for an around-town kinda car. I'm not sure I would ever own one, but if I lived downtown, this does fit a niche.
Ed
150 miles? That sounds like a DC Motor with lead acid batteries. I didn't read the article as it isn't of much interest. I'm not seeing anything 'new' or innovative here.
I am willing to bet that at least once your car has threatened to leave you stranded. Am I wrong to assume that on your road trips you have a toolbox and spares - and you have used it? YRMV...
jmackro
Well-Known Member
My sense is that a lot of the engineering that goes into cars like the Tesla Model S involves packaging enough batteries to give a 200+ mile range. When retrofitting electric propulsion into an older cars, you just don't have the freedom to pack them underfloor or as efficiently fore and aft of the cabin. So these conversions with 150 mile ranges no doubt use state-of-the-art batteries, but fewer of them.
Since most of the cost of an EV is in the batteries, the companies who do these conversions have probably found that buyers really don't drive them very far and as such, don't want to pay for more batteries to achieve more range.
Aside from range, another thing I find amusing about this topic is the term "electric crate motor", which makes it sound as if pulling your e9 drivetrain and bolting in that electric motor & batteries is a simple weekend job. I'll bet that most of the population today have never turned a wrench; they just watch reality TV that convinces them that modifying old cars is an easy, bolt-in job.
What these geniuses have done, is realize there is a market for wrecked Teslas! The scrap yards are selling Tesla battery packs and other bits. I'm certain there are guys who specialize in those battery packs and re-sell them to the highest bidders. Moment uses Tesla packs, but I'm sure you could use Prius packs too.
As you also mention... it is NOT a drop in conversion. These battery packs must be fitted into nooks and crannies, many times they are placed in liquid cooled cases. It is all very ingenious, really. I've seen the shops and the amount of effort involved to get it right. Moment Motors is unique in that they keep the original transmission and rear drivetrain; only removing the engines and milling up an adapter plate for the motor-to-transmission. You can shift like normal, or simply leave it in 3rd and drive it like a golf cart. It's a strange sensation...not pushing in the clutch at a light, no noise, no vibrations.
I had a hot-ride in the Bloodshed Motors' Zombie... '67 Mustang Fastback. This car will pull the front wheels off the ground and set The Texas Mile record of 174mph a few years ago. It is...not for the timid.
Ed
I think his last story was about driving the last several hundred miles with a broken exhaust manifold, but I'm not one to talk since I've driven thirty miles with a broken center bearing.
Yeah come to think of it those 30yo DC conversions with lead acid he a range of about 30 miles.
I used to want an e-914 conversion).
I think there would be a great market for replica Cobras, like Factory Five's with electric drive motors. They're a build it yourself product anyhow... Hmmm gives me an idea
Mike Goble
Well-Known Member
I do carry tools and spares. I've had a few failures, like quibos, fuel pumps, wheel bearings but I've never had to call a tow. Guibos will last a long time once they fail as I've driven from Phoenix to the Bay Area non-stop with barely any rubber left on it. I now use the late style quibo and carry a spare. I have spare fuel pumps on board and it takes about 15 minutes to change it, depending on how much stuff I have in the trunk. My repair kit includes a roll of baling wire and duct tape.
The closest I got to being stranded was in Shoshone, ID early one morning when the rubbing block on my points suddenly broke and the car stopped cold. To my good fortune I was about a block from a NAPA store and bought a new set of points. Now I carry a spare.
My trip down into Mexico was marred only by a flat tire.
Prius and Hybrid batteries in general are not the same as EV batteries. They are designed for rapid charge and discharge so they can assist the gas engine in managing the varying loads of driving in traffic. Batteries from a Leaf would work as well as the Tesla batteries but I think they are less likely to get wrecked since they aren't as much fun to drive.
We've been evaluating Tesla vehicles for parts for a while now. Getting closer to pulling the trigger and buying some "R&D" cars to get numbers. When I had a side business of cleaning up body shops and selling late model parts out of my shop, we picked up from the only Tesla certified collision center in the valley. It was mostly collision parts, headlights, panels, suspension pieces, cross-members, and we hardly sold anything. When the Model S was pretty much the onlyTesla on the road, one would get totaled and Tesla would disable it. The only way to get them turned back on was for the car to be re-certified through one of their service locations, like the one we picked up at. We guessed that this was a big reason no "Builders" were fixing Teslas.
I think most of the value in selling parts off of them would be the drive train and electronics.
I think most of the value in selling parts off of them would be the drive train and electronics.
Rek
Well-Known Member
"Your scientists were so pre-occupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should" This is Jeff Goldblum's ethics lesson to Hammond in Jurassic Park.
It's of relevance here.
There is also, at least in the UK, the status which our cars enjoy as classics in that we pay no road tax, insurance is cheaper and we are exempt from all sorts of things regarding pollution as they are considered to be part of the heritage of cars and are as such encouraged. An electric motor would be a modification too far and would remove these benefits.
I agree that our cars can break down and are comparatively unreliable but they can do long mileage journeys and good maintenance can obviate the risks. That said, there are downsides to electric cars too in that the range is inconvenient, chargers are frequently broken or there is a queue, and the time taken for a charge is very long in most cases.
Finally, there is the driving experience which I enjoy as an analogue pleasure. That is lost in the digital world of electric cars. Where is the joy from the sound of red-lining a sewing machine?
Electric propulsion is obviously the way forward but leave classics alone. Old buildings have protected status here as despite the fact that they are draughty, expensive to run and more inconvenient that modern buildings, they form part of the fabric of our society and as such, knocking them down eliminates a link with the past which is needed to add balance to our future.
It's of relevance here.
There is also, at least in the UK, the status which our cars enjoy as classics in that we pay no road tax, insurance is cheaper and we are exempt from all sorts of things regarding pollution as they are considered to be part of the heritage of cars and are as such encouraged. An electric motor would be a modification too far and would remove these benefits.
I agree that our cars can break down and are comparatively unreliable but they can do long mileage journeys and good maintenance can obviate the risks. That said, there are downsides to electric cars too in that the range is inconvenient, chargers are frequently broken or there is a queue, and the time taken for a charge is very long in most cases.
Finally, there is the driving experience which I enjoy as an analogue pleasure. That is lost in the digital world of electric cars. Where is the joy from the sound of red-lining a sewing machine?
Electric propulsion is obviously the way forward but leave classics alone. Old buildings have protected status here as despite the fact that they are draughty, expensive to run and more inconvenient that modern buildings, they form part of the fabric of our society and as such, knocking them down eliminates a link with the past which is needed to add balance to our future.
I think there would be a great market for replica Cobras, like Factory Five's with electric drive motors. They're a build it yourself product anyhow... Hmmm gives me an idea
Moment is working on one right now. They were closed when I got by there last week, but it was sitting out front and they show the start of work on their FB page.
absolutely agree, driving a classic car shell powered by electricity is essentially idiotic and against good taste, i would prefer to be driven by an autonomous vehicle
but what if the essence of the classic cars is essentially forbidden ?
i like your example of those old buildings, because they are clearly less efficient and so on, but hey we still have those XII century churches, and a lot more buildings coming after them, what should we do, close them and look at them from outside ?
another point is that any of those electric conversions will need to be approved and homologated, and that will make the whole thing out of reach
jmackro
Well-Known Member
Rek said:
Peter has a great suggestion: go ahead and put electric propulsion in a plastic Cobra, or VW-based 356. Add the big fender flares, 500w stereo and cupholders while you're at it, and there's no harm done. But don't destroy an irreplaceable artifact just to build something that won't be accepted at shows or on tours and in the end will seldom be driven.
Unless the point is to explore another path history may have taken if Ferdinand Porsche would have focused in 1898 on battery development:
The Egger-Lohner was a carriage-like car driven by two electric motors within the front wheel hubs, powered by batteries. This drive train construction was easily expanded to four-wheel drive, by mounting two more electric motors to the rear wheels, and a four-motor example was ordered by Englishman E. W. Hart in 1900. In December that year, the car was displayed at the Paris World Exhibition under the name Toujours-Contente. Even though this one-off vehicle[14] had been commissioned for the purposes of racing and record-breaking, its 1,800 kg (4,000 lb) of lead–acid batteries was a severe shortcoming . Though it "showed wonderful speed when it was allowed to sprint",[citation needed] the weight of the batteries rendered it slow to climb hills. It also suffered from limited range due to limited battery life.
The Egger-Lohner was a carriage-like car driven by two electric motors within the front wheel hubs, powered by batteries. This drive train construction was easily expanded to four-wheel drive, by mounting two more electric motors to the rear wheels, and a four-motor example was ordered by Englishman E. W. Hart in 1900. In December that year, the car was displayed at the Paris World Exhibition under the name Toujours-Contente. Even though this one-off vehicle[14] had been commissioned for the purposes of racing and record-breaking, its 1,800 kg (4,000 lb) of lead–acid batteries was a severe shortcoming . Though it "showed wonderful speed when it was allowed to sprint",[citation needed] the weight of the batteries rendered it slow to climb hills. It also suffered from limited range due to limited battery life.