Buying an e34 M5

[WALTER]

I am interested in purchasing an e34 M5 from a dealer in Durham, NC. Having done the research on these cars, they appear to be a handful if proper maintenance has not been done on them (probably a handful even if proper maintenance has been done). In order to avoid buying a high strung car with too many surprises, I want to have a PPI done. Does anyone know a good BMW mechanic in Durham; one that is familiar with this model? I know that Korman BMW is only 50 miles away in Greensboro, but the dealer is unwilling to send it "that far." Your help is appreciated.

thanks,

Walt

 

[JFENG]

Poi shop

I dunno if I would use Korman for this work, although they could retrieve it back to Greensboro to inspect ( it would be expensive, speaking from experience).

They did an overall satisfactory job for me inspecting an E9.
An e34 is a much more complex beast. How about the local BMW dealer?

 

[duane_sword]

If in doubt head to the dealer$hip

I had an E34 M5 a few years back, it was a 1993 model (and I owned it from 2005-2007)... I loved the car, the engine was magnificent and I wish I still had it, alas I was too greedy and ran out of garage space.

Anyway, if you don't have a shop that has worked on the E34 and isn't familiar with the issues with the self-leveling suspension and various quirks with the M5 version of the E34 in particular then I agree with John completely; go to a BMW dealer and hope that there is a technician old enough who was trained on the E34 M5 that was discontinued in 1995.

Good luck, the E34 M5 is one of my favorite 4door sedans, my favorite is the Maserati Quattroporte, then the E39 M5.

 

[Nicad]

I had my E46 wagon inspected at a BMW dealer. They told me the air pressure in the tires was low and that I needed windshield washer fluid. WHen I asked if it had been in an accident, they said no idea. We went to get the body shop manager then he gave it a look over. It was the most pathetic PPI I have ever seen. The PPI at a BMW dealer in Wisconsin for my E36 M3 was only 1 notch better. Dealers aren't what they used to be.

 

[WALTER]

I am a little hesitant going to a dealer because as was mentioned, unless there is a tech that is old enough to remember/have worked on these cars, it might be a crap shoot whether or not you get a quality inspection. Most of the mechs I see at dealerships tend to be pretty young.

Does anyone know of a shop called Bimmer Performance Center in Raleigh?

Thanks,

Walt

 

[JFENG]

I would post on the M5 forum as well as try contacting

the local chapter board members for recommendations of good PPI shops.
I've always gotten great support/response from local chapters, and have even had members pick me up from the airport to go see cars for sale.

John Feng

 

[WALTER]

Gents,

Thanks for all your help so far. I decided to go with Bimmer Performance Center for the PPI. They said it was overall one of the cleanest e34 M5's that they have seen, but admitted that they don't come across to many. Most of what they reported was normal wear and tear stuff that is to be expected in a 20 year car; however, I was concerned with the compression and leakdown numbers as the are a bit out spec. The numbers are as follows:

Compression Test Numbers and Leak Down
175 17% Rings
180 24% Rings
160 28% Rings
160 30% Rings
165 30% Rings
175 28% Rings

Is this a huge red flag for these engines or do you think this engine (all else being sound) perform well for 25 - 50K miles before needing a rebuild. I don't want to buy an M5 that needs an immediate rebuild. Appreciate the advice. Thanks.

 

[JFENG]

was this a hot test and did they repeat it wet to ascertain it is the rings?

was this a hot test and did they repeat it wet to ascertain it is the rings?

If yes, I'd budget for a engine refresh (all bearings, pistons/rings, valve job with springs/followers, and maybe cam bearings).


John

 

[WALTER]

John,

I forgot to ask, but I will today

Thanks,

Walt

 

[x_atlas0]

The numbers look nice and even, but they are low. If done warm, a S38 should read in the 200+ range.

As the E34s have aged, I have had to find mechanics by testing them first, just like I do with the E9. When something does go wrong, I do everything I can to find the true root cause. If it is something fairly simple and/or messy, I try a local. I also participate in another E34 forum to try and find good mechanics in my area that truly know the generation of vehicle.

So far, the best shops I have been able to find in my area are all about 150 miles from home.

The other thing about S38s- they usually need head rebuilds, not bottom-end work. The S38B38 can need main bearing work due to transverse high-speed loading, but this is a B36, so it should be fine.

 

[Mike Goble]

I'm always fascinated with leakdown tests expressed as a percent. Percent of what? Is there a standard by which this percent is expressed?

 

[WALTER]

This is what I got back from the shop:

Good morning Walter

When we did the leak down and compression test we let the car sit over night in the shop and performed the leak down/compression test cold the next morning. It was not necessary to do a wet test because Dan could hear air coming out of the valve cover with the oil fill cap off. This indicates that it was going by the rings. If the air had been coming out of the intake or exhaust that would have indicated that it was a valve issue. As far as cost to rebuild engine, we would not have an answer until engine is taken apart. If we were to guess between 8-12,000 in labor and parts.

Is air going by the rings less serious than it going by the valves?

X_atlas0, you mentioned that a head rebuild is more normal than a bottom end for these motors. Do you have an idea of what a head rebuild might cost on an S38B36?

At this point, I am trying to avoid buying a car that will need $5000 (or more) in repairs/preventative maintenance on top of the purchase price. It seems like this car may not be the one.

-Walt

 

[sfdon]

Those numbers don't look right to me. I would start by asking for a different gauge and a minimum of TWO sets of numbers. I have to say it looks like they forgot to open the the throttles. I wouldn't touch a car missing that much compression -40lbs is huge

 

[sfdon]

Walter- I sold three Ferrari's for my client last week. He still has a e28 Dinan stroker for sale in incredible condition. After I tune it it will be available.

 

[TodB]

E28 stroker

Is the e28 an m5 or regular M30? Dinan did both...

 

[WALTER]

Don,

I'll give a call today.

Thanks,

Walt

 

[sfdon]

It's the M5 version of the e28

 

[sfdon]

Walter- let the phone ring longer!

 

[WALTER]

I'll try again today.

 

[JFENG]

Leakdown testingn

"Leakdown percentage of what"

Shade tree opinion on what it means: you supply a given amount of air pressure ( your choice but 100psi is a typical top number on typical gauges). The tester as a second gauge that shows the static pressure on the cylinder. It's the supplies P minus what is leaking out. For example, I did my jag engine this weekend. Inlet gauge at 100psi, and cylinder gauge at 98psi. Therefore my leakdown was 2% on that cylinder. Obviously, using 100psi as he reference makes expressing the result as a percentage eAsier, and its correct to present it as a relative amount anyway.