Steering

Hi Guys,


To get straight to the point, I love my coupe, but I hate the steering, I think it really stuff's up an otherwise nice driving experience.
I guess its mainly due to the steering box system which I have never liked as apposed a rack and pinion setup, which is always direct and precise with great feedback.
The thing that bugs me most with the steering box system is that little bit of side to side free play / slop that you get when the car is driving straight, I have adjusted my steering box up as much as I dare without over tightening it to try and improve things but its still there.
The other thing with the coupe steering is the amount of turns lock to lock, its a bit like an old truck, far to many turns!
I know the car is 40 odd years old, and that steering like this is all part of the experience etc etc, but not for me, I don't like it and I am determined to do something about it.

I have already tried adding a steering quickner (1:1.5 ratio) into the main steering column to help speed the steering up, whilst it does work, it had the unwanted side effects of making the steering heaver (probably the same as a non power steer box) manageable but not that nice, it also magnified the side to side free play in the steering wheel somewhat.

I have done a search for Rack and Pinion, and this didn't really come up with anything more than a few of the guys with race cars using it, nothing for the road cars.

I have spent a bit of time looking at the car to see how, and if it would be possible to install a rack, and my conclusion is that I think it is do-able.

The other option is another steering box out of a later model BMW, I was quite surprised the other day to find that BMW stayed with the steering box system right up to the e39, Knowing that the BMW engineers wouldn't accept horrible sloppy steering from a steering box system I assume that these are a lot better that the e9 system, so my question is would it be at all possible to install a later model steering box into the coupe from something like an e34 or e39 maybe as another option? this could potentially be less work?


Whats your thoughts?


Steve

I wonder if what you experience may be due to the play of your steering box rather than being a generic problem. I had the play problem in my E24 and replaced the steering box with a rebuilt one (rebuilt by ZF themselves I think) and it was the best of all upgrades I did to the car. Day and night.

My coupe did not have that play so I never faced that need and I do not know who rebuilds our boxes. Lastly I heard good things about the CSL non assisted box, but it gets heavier for parking and city I believe, plus they are hard to find.

Hi Steve, Have been looking into rack and pinion for my coupe as well and am considering a steering rack from the E30, Needs to fit onto the front of the crossmember 2x brackets, and then you will need to find E30 rack ends and E9 Ball Joints, the main reason I see for fitting a rack and pinion system is the clearance for a decent set of extractors!!

wazza.csi said:

Hi Steve, Have been looking into rack and pinion for my coupe as well and am considering a steering rack from the E30, Needs to fit onto the front of the crossmember 2x brackets, and then you will need to find E30 rack ends and E9 Ball Joints, the main reason I see for fitting a rack and pinion system is the clearance for a decent set of extractors!!

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For me I not worried about the headers, its just the steering, I drive my wife's Mini Cooper S and the steering in that is beautiful, direct precise, not to heavy, not to light and fast lock to lock.

Was even driving my 1999 work Ford Transit van the other day and that too has superb steering, a much nicer experience than the coupe.

I came from an E39 with recirc ball steering, so aside from the ratio being slower, it never really bothered me too much.

You can tighten the unit down, but you might want to look into replacing the steering box before you try and mod in a rack and pinion set up.

I'm going to look more into these, looks like a nice unit, with all that adjust-ability it may be just the thing

http://youtu.be/OOi6InERMW4

Did you hear the price?? $3k NZ!!

wazza.csi said:

Did you hear the price?? $3k NZ!!

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$3000 is only a drop in the bucket to what I have already spent Warren! if it means nice steering I will more than likely go for it.

John Buchtenkirch said:

The second photo is the smaller in diameter TII booster in a coupe.

View attachment 9701

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Here's a r&p setup on a coupe, perhaps JB can shed some light on it.

Mike Goble said:

Here's a r&p setup on a coupe, perhaps JB can shed some light on it.

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Hmm. That looks more like an '02...

If you can deal with the extra weight during parking and low speed maneuvers, the manual steering setup improves steering feel considerably on these cars, IMHO. Although I'd imagine finding a RHD manual setup would be even more difficult than a LHD setup.

Hi Steve, I think something like this would fit great, maybe $200 for a complete rebuild,
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-parts-accessories/bmw/steering/auction-689087372.htm
And he is just down the road from you!!

I sold a CS with power steering and got a CSL with the manual box. Night and day. Probably three grAnd also, when you can find one, but straightforward to install. Much less free play, and a great vintage feel with a big Petri.
My roommate in medical school had a very high mileage e28 and it had wonderful steering I thought at the time.
No car steered better than my moms 1985 Audi coupe GT, however. Very odd for a nose heavy front driver. Just a wonderful car to drive, albeit a slow car with only 130hp.

wazza.csi said:

Hi Steve, I think something like this would fit great, maybe $200 for a complete rebuild,
http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-parts-accessories/bmw/steering/auction-689087372.htm
And he is just down the road from you!!

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The problem with retro fitting any other OEM rack will be getting just the right length ( has to be the same as the standard e9 drag link, then you have to mount it just right so there is no bump steer, and finally get the steering column connected, getting all three of these things right is very very hard, that's why those guys ended up making the Retro rack with all its adjustability, and the centre take of bar makes it even easier.

craterface said:

I sold a CS with power steering and got a CSL with the manual box. Night and day. Probably three grAnd also, when you can find one, but straightforward to install. Much less free play, and a great vintage feel with a big Petri.

But still very heavy steering I suspect?



My roommate in medical school had a very high mileage e28 and it had wonderful steering I thought at the time.
No car steered better than my moms 1985 Audi coupe GT, however. Very odd for a nose heavy front driver. Just a wonderful car to drive, albeit a slow car with only 130hp.

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Nicest steering car I have ever driven was my Peugeot 309gti, it was power steer, but just only a little bit, it had wonderful feeling and feed back, and my god, did that car handle!
It was a revelation, on the limit it could be steered on the throttle, lift of the gas in a corner and the back would slide, put a but of power on and the back would tuck in and the front would start to lightly under steer, it really was a marvellous car to drive, just a pity about the really bad 1980's plastic breaking at the lightest touch! 1.9 litre and 130 hp, a really really nice drivers car.
Only car I have driven since that is better is my wife's Mini Cooper S JCW, but that thing is just insane, it has all the electronic driving aids, so doesn't quite have the same raw feel that the Peugeot gave, but mind blowingly fast.

As I recall, e21 R&P mounts on the rear of the subframe.

These might guide you also:



















JP

e21 Steering racks

Cheers for those pictures, definitely food for thought, will have to have a look at this option