What type of wrench is recommended to remove the starter bolts that I don't know about? It's bad enough I have to remove the rear manifold in my CSi, but getting to the bolts is still impossible with a socket and any offset box-end wrenches I have. Anybody know of any short-cuts or tricks? Thanks for any help.
starter removal
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decoupe
(deceased)
I believe that if you cut down a cheapie 19mm (or is it 17mm?) socket to the depth of the bolt head, slip it on the mounting bolt head and then insert a long extension into the socket you can fiddle it loose. A total PIA but it can be done.
Doug
Doug
MMercury
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You may be setting yourself up for something that is not that difficult. Of course, much depends upon how tight the bolts are. The archives have touched on this subject and if you haven't looked there yet, try this: http://www.e9coupe.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5869
Demonstrating is easier than describing the process, but as I recall, I have been fortunate to use an extremely shallow 3/8" drive, 6 pointed 17mm socket for both bolts. It is one of those odd sockets that almost looks like it belongs with a 1/4" drive set. Each bolt uses a different combination of extensions and flex-joints. For the remaining bolt, I have also used used a very thin light alloy double box wrench to initially break the bolt loose. It resembles one of the stacked wrenches pictured below.
Another possibility is using a "manifold" or "starter" wrench. Yes, that is what they are sometimes called. Several are pictured below, and there are a variety of differently shapes and sizes. Making your own by heating and bending a donor wrench is another possibility. There are undoubtedly some short or stubby box or open end wrenches that would probably work, but smaller size sacrifices leverage.
While this is off topic, some that are interested in tool kits may find this site depicting vintage mercedes kits worth exploring: http://www.mbzponton.org/valueadded/maintenance/toolkit.htm And for those who may not have every tool, can always window shop here: http://www.samstagsales.com/gedore.htm ; http://www.samstagsales.com/hazet.htm
I believe that later m30 engines employed allen cap head bolts rather than the standard hex bolts. I suspect some on this board have commented about it. In any event, given the limited space, a hex bit socket tends to be an easier fit than the standard setup.
HTH
a different case as i am carbureted, but also a PIA
the problem is that when i want to remove it from the car; i need to dissassemble the admision also; and that is really a problem
my case is slightly different, as my engine is carburetted, and so the 2 bolts (hexagon head) can be reached (with some difficulty)
the problem is that when i want to remove it from the car; i need to dissassemble the admision also; and that is really a problem
my case is slightly different, as my engine is carburetted, and so the 2 bolts (hexagon head) can be reached (with some difficulty)
Thanks for the responses...and MMercury, as usual, right there with a ton of useful suggestions. I pictured in my mind all the tools you suggested and wished to heck I had one of them in my collection as I was laboring away on the bolts to no avail. I'll see what I can find at NSPA et al.
jmackro
Well-Known Member
I concur with deQuincey - starter removal on a carbureted car isn't all that hard. I just remember using an open end wrench and some standard sockets. Of course, the rear manifold & carburetor has to come off to provide access.
What is it about the fuel injected cars that makes starter removal so much more difficult?
Replace with newer M30 starter
The original style started has a wide diameter body that makes straight access parallel to the starter impossible. The later M30's used a smaller diameter body starter where you can parallel access the bolts with a long extension and socket coming in directly from the front (under the d-jet logs). I used a started off an e32 on the original 3.0 engine. Works just fine. It should then be easier to reinstall and take off in the future.
The original style started has a wide diameter body that makes straight access parallel to the starter impossible. The later M30's used a smaller diameter body starter where you can parallel access the bolts with a long extension and socket coming in directly from the front (under the d-jet logs). I used a started off an e32 on the original 3.0 engine. Works just fine. It should then be easier to reinstall and take off in the future.
Finally got the starter out using box-end wrenches, including a stubby. Sven: it is difficult in the sense that three C-tubes, the intake plenum (log), the rear 3 injectors along with the rear manifold, the main relay, and cold start relay all have to be removed in order to get enough room to leverage the wrenches. A lot of tedious work to get at the starter, that's all. But I got it out and have discovered the reason for my starter problems (dead spots): the armature is grounding against the field coils, so I have to attend to that....
Buy the smaller permanent magnet starter used in the M3 S14 motor, mine is a Bosch SR-441X but it can also be found as an SR-71X or SR-41X. Just be sure it has the smaller case.
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x_atlas0
Well-Known Member
Does it have enough cranking power? I know the CR on the M30 is lower, but the M30 also has another 2 cylinders to move compared to the S14.
These starters have plenty of power for the M30. On my 2002 it starts in a nanosecond though with fewer cylinders! I only paid $105 and no core charge, bnrparts on eBay in the San Fernando valley, very knowledgeable too.
decoupe
(deceased)
Sr 71x
I have the S14 starter in my 73CS and it has no issues turning over - if anything it has more torque than the stock starter. One single Odyssey 680 battery (http://www.odysseyfactory.com/battspecs.html - weighs about 15lbs) has no problem starting the car.
Doug
I have the S14 starter in my 73CS and it has no issues turning over - if anything it has more torque than the stock starter. One single Odyssey 680 battery (http://www.odysseyfactory.com/battspecs.html - weighs about 15lbs) has no problem starting the car.
Doug
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